Jump to content

SovereignGraceSingles

Welcome to SovereignGraceSingles.com. Where Reformed Faith and Romance Come Together! We are the only Christian dating website for Christian Singles in the Reformed Faith worldwide. Our focus is to bring together Christian singles of all ages. Reformed single Christian men and women who wish to meet other Reformed Christian singles for spiritually, like-minded, loving relationships.
Join us now

SovereignGraceSingles

Then the Lord God said, “It is not good for the man to be alone; I will make him a helper suitable for him.” - Genesis 2:18
Join us now

SovereignGraceSingles

Meet Like Minded Believers Can two walk together except they be agreed? - Amos 3:3
Join us now

SovereignGraceSingles

John Calvin puts forward a very simple reason why love is the greatest gift: “Because faith and hope are our own: love is diffused among others.” In other words, faith and hope benefit the possessor, but love always benefits another. In John 13:34–35 Jesus says, “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” Love always requires an “other” as an object; love cannot remain within itself, and that is part of what makes love the greatest gift.
Join us now

SovereignGraceSingles

SGS offers a "fenced" community: both for private single members and also a public Protestant forums open to Bible-believing Christians such as Presbyterians, Lutherans, Reformed, Baptists, Church of Christ members, Pentecostals, Anglicans. Methodists, Charismatics, or any other conservative, Nicene-derived Christian Church.
Join us now
Guest

Poll Question: Will the temple be rebuilt?

Will the temple be rebuilt?  

16 members have voted

  1. 1. Will the temple be rebuilt?



Recommended Posts

Guest Becky
21 minutes ago, davidtaylorjr said:

No, it is a fact.

 

Sure

 

Notice I am talking about specific sections of passages and also that numbers can be symbolic or literal depending on context. So yes, you did, in fact, misrepresent me.  You know good and well all of Revelation is not symbolic yet you refuse to go there and dismiss it as a game because it blows up in your face.

 

On 3/23/2019 at 10:19 AM, Origen said:

David I am not going to play this game with you.  There is simply no point to it.  You prefer a dispensational methodology.  That is your lens.  Thus your simplistic question is pointless.  If it were merely a matter of who takes this or that to be symbolic, no group (dispensational or not) takes everything in Revelation to be symbolic or for that matter literal.

 

As I have said before (and as Heiser also points out), the Bible must be interpreted in context.  But what is often not stated is that the context isn't our own or that of some theological tradition.  It is the context that produced it, namely the ancient Near East/Mediterranean world.  God chose people to write the biblical text, and people write using grammar, in styles understood by their peers, and with deliberate intent. We need to understand a text from their point of view not ours.

Guess maybe you did not read Origen reply to you back in post #21  and repeated again in post #26 ..  

Share this post


Link to post
davidtaylorjr
2 minutes ago, Origen said:

Don't care what you think on the matter.

Well you should because you are slandering me. You owe me an apology.

1 minute ago, Becky said:

Guess maybe you did not read Origen reply to you back in post #21  and repeated again in post #26 ..  

No I read it but he doesn't want to engage the topic. That's what I'm saying.  I'm tired of the slander.

Share this post


Link to post
CDF47
3 hours ago, Origen said:

Exactly!  There seems to be a rule if there is a specific number mentioned it must be taken literally.  There is no reason to even entertain such an idea.  The truth is such a rule is meant to stack the deck.  It ignores literary genre, cultural context, and historical setting.  The only purpose of such a rule is to force an interpretation upon a text.  If one follows such an obviously flawed rule (i.e. hermeneutical methodology) misunderstand of the text's meaning is sure to follow.

 

Agreed!

Edited by CDF47

Share this post


Link to post
Guest
6 minutes ago, davidtaylorjr said:

You owe me an apology.

stephen king dreaming GIF

Share this post


Link to post
davidtaylorjr
2 minutes ago, Origen said:

stephen king dreaming GIF

Real mature.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest
1 hour ago, davidtaylorjr said:

Real mature.

Well, that is the only place you will hear an apology.

Share this post


Link to post
davidtaylorjr
1 hour ago, Origen said:

Well, that is the only place you will hear an apology.

It's a sad state of affairs when moderators and staff resort to mocking members they disagree with. Slander them. And all sorts of other behavior.  It's not just you, it is the entire staff.

 

Obviously, this is not a place for all protestants. This is a place for people who only believe exactly as you do.  This will probably be my last post. The arrogance, rudeness and unchristian behavior of the staff is just too much.

Share this post


Link to post
Deidre

 

1 hour ago, Origen said:

You have a number of problems.

 

First, those two passages no where mentions an anti-christ.

 

Second, you link them together without any evidence.

 

Third, the gender of the word βδέλυγμα (i.e. abomination) is neuter.

 

Fourth, the phrase "takes his seat in the temple of God" can be understood metaphorically.  This is nothing new.

When I stated ''he'', it wasn't meant to refer to gender. And the anti christ is inferred. But, no it's not spelled out. I stated that above. But, in 1 John 2, 1 John 4 - and 2 John 1 - it is stated. 

 

Whether it's a matter of semantics or not, Jesus told us to always be alert. True believers won't be deceived, as others who claim to be followers, will be. 

Edited by Deidre

Share this post


Link to post
Guest
19 minutes ago, Deidre said:

When I stated ''he'', it wasn't meant to refer to gender.

Try "it."

 

19 minutes ago, Deidre said:

And the anti christ is inferred.

That is an opinion.

 

19 minutes ago, Deidre said:

in 1 John 2, 1 John 4 - and 2 John 1 - it is stated. 

You have not understood those verses in context.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Guest William
23 minutes ago, davidtaylorjr said:

It's a sad state of affairs when moderators and staff resort to mocking members they disagree with. Slander them. And all sorts of other behavior.  It's not just you, it is the entire staff.

 

Obviously, this is not a place for all protestants. This is a place for people who only believe exactly as you do.  This will probably be my last post. The arrogance, rudeness and unchristian behavior of the staff is just too much.

"The best way to get rid of the Devil, if you cannot kill it with the words of Holy Scripture, is to rail at and mock him."

"I often laugh at Satan, and there is nothing that makes him so angry as when I attack him to his face, and tell him that through God I am more than a match for him"

 

 Martin Luther

Share this post


Link to post
Guest

Just so everyone knows my stance.

 

Sometimes numbers are to be taken literally.

 

Sometimes numbers are to be taken figuratively\symbolically.


Sometimes numbers can be understood as both.  A number can have a literal reference but also have symbolic significance beyond its literal reference.

The idea that one rule fits all is pure nonsense in my view.  The truth is no really knows if a number is literal, symbolic, or both simply by looking at it.  Only exegesis within a text's OWN historical, cultural, literary, and theological contexts can provide any real meaning.  Throw away all your 20/21 century ideas and theologies and try to understand the text as the author intended.  Try not to bring your presuppositions to the text.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest Becky
1 hour ago, Deidre said:

 

When I stated ''he'', it wasn't meant to refer to gender. And the anti christ is inferred. But, no it's not spelled out. I stated that above. But, in 1 John 2, 1 John 4 - and 2 John 1 - it is stated. 

 

Whether it's a matter of semantics or not, Jesus told us to always be alert. True believers won't be deceived, as others who claim to be followers, will be. 

Yes that is the only place it is stated in most all translations. Please re-read those passages and tell me which speaks of one man or person. 

 

1Jn 2:18  Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

1Jn_2:22  Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. 
1Jn_4:3  And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 
2Jn_1:7  For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. 
 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Deidre
13 minutes ago, Becky said:

Yes that is the only place it is stated in most all translations. Please re-read those passages and tell me which speaks of one man or person. 

 

1Jn 2:18  Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

1Jn_2:22  Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. 
1Jn_4:3  And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 
2Jn_1:7  For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. 
 

 

 

 

I honestly don't know, if there will be ''one'' entity or if it will be a group, etc. 1 John 2:18 - it is said that there have been antichrists already, that have come. Who were they? Were they false religions or false prophets? Were they concepts, or political correctness that we see today? I'm not sure, tbh.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest
8 minutes ago, Deidre said:

it is said that there have been antichrists already, that have come. Who were they?

We don't know.

 

8 minutes ago, Deidre said:

Were they false religions or false prophets?

Most likely both.

 

8 minutes ago, Deidre said:

Were they concepts, or political correctness that we see today?

No doubt that too was part of it.  Note the phrase "spirit of antichrist."

 

Share this post


Link to post
Guest
1 hour ago, davidtaylorjr said:

No I read it but he doesn't want to engage the topic. That's what I'm saying. 

Then you should have used those words instead of making a false claim.  As @Becky clearly points out in post 76 I NEVER said that all of Revelation was symbolic.

 

1 hour ago, davidtaylorjr said:

I'm tired of the slander.

I know just what you mean.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest William
3 hours ago, davidtaylorjr said:

Obviously, this is not a place for all protestants.

As it was said, only a lunatic would lump everyone in the same boat

 

boat fail GIF

Share this post


Link to post
deade
6 hours ago, Deidre said:

While not entirely spelled out, the passages found in Matthew 24:15 and II Thessolonians 2:3-4 infer that an anti-christ will come and ''dwell in the temple of God,'' and will act as though he is greater than God. Could this mean that an actual temple needs to be constructed? Maybe. But, the prophecy itself leads to the ''end times,'' according to Scripture.

 

Say Deidre, did you ever think this antichrist could be in "a temple" that he only considers to be God's? All the while showing himself to be God or in the place of Christ (Vicar of Christ). Kind of looks like the Vatican and the Pope to me.

Something to consider, no?  :RpS_thumbup:

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Guest Becky

I am no fan of the RCC . Read how the Scriptures define or describe antichrist  to me the RCC does not fit the description 

 

Another point Jesus said .. Mat_24:15  When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 

Do you think Jesus was calling some part of the Vatican holy?  What do the mountains of Judea have to do with Italy?  

Share this post


Link to post
CDF47
29 minutes ago, deade said:

 

Say Deidre, did you ever think this antichrist could be in "a temple" that he only considers to be God's? All the while showing himself to be God or in the place of Christ (Vicar of Christ). Kind of looks like the Vatican and the Pope to me.

Something to consider, no?  :RpS_thumbup:

That is what I believe as well.

13 minutes ago, Becky said:

I am no fan of the RCC . Read how the Scriptures define or describe antichrist  to me the RCC does not fit the description 

 

Another point Jesus said .. Mat_24:15  When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 

Do you think Jesus was calling some part of the Vatican holy?  What do the mountains of Judea have to do with Italy?  

I don't think He was referring to a third temple.

Edited by CDF47

Share this post


Link to post
Guest Becky
3 minutes ago, CDF47 said:

I don't think he was referring to a third temple.

Who he?   Jesus, Deade or maybe both? 

Share this post


Link to post
CDF47
Just now, Becky said:

Who he?   Jesus, Deade or maybe both? 

Jesus. I meant He.

Share this post


Link to post
Matthew A.Duvall
On ‎3‎/‎23‎/‎2019 at 11:21 PM, Becky said:

How is there a holy place or a holy of hoilies in this third temple ?  Does a place become holy cause man says it is? I believe most every one posting here agrees the Temple in Jerusalem 2000 years ago had an holy place  The Veil  rent from the top to the bottom When the Lamb was Slain . The presence of God is what made it holy .. 

Jesus said ...Mat 24:15  When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 

Will God insult Jesus  and label a place set up for the blood of bulls as holy? 

 

Heb 10:1  For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. 
Heb 10:2  For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins. 
Heb 10:3  But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year. 
Heb 10:4  For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins. 
Heb 10:5  Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me: 
Heb 10:6  In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure. 
Heb 10:7  Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God. 
Heb 10:8  Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law; 
Heb 10:9  Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second. 
Heb 10:10  By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. 
 

Good thought . There may be a holy of holies in this third temple .But they are playing a dangerous game since this would require a high priest. And that is blasphemy since the high priest was mimicking Jesus Christ and the only one who could have direct communication with God. And that's the work of the devil !

Share this post


Link to post
CDF47
29 minutes ago, Becky said:

I am no fan of the RCC . Read how the Scriptures define or describe antichrist  to me the RCC does not fit the description 

 

Another point Jesus said .. Mat_24:15  When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 

Do you think Jesus was calling some part of the Vatican holy?  What do the mountains of Judea have to do with Italy?  

What do Matthew Henry and other interpreters have to say about that verse?

Share this post


Link to post
Guest Becky
2 minutes ago, Matthew Duvall said:

Good thought . There may be a holy of holies in this third temple .But they are playing a dangerous game since this would require a high priest. And that is blasphemy since the high priest was mimicking Jesus Christ and the only one who could have direct communication with God. And that's the work of the devil !

Agree therefore it could not be holy .  The Holy of Holies was more then a name of a place in the temple. 

Luk 23:45  And the sun was darkened, and the veil of the temple was rent in the midst. 

 

Mar 2:21  No man also seweth a piece of new cloth on an old garment: else the new piece that filled it up taketh away from the old, and the rent is made worse. 
Mar 2:22  And no man putteth new wine into old bottles: else the new wine doth burst the bottles, and the wine is spilled, and the bottles will be marred: but new wine must be put into new bottles. 
 

Share this post


Link to post
Guest Becky
12 minutes ago, CDF47 said:

What do Matthew Henry and other interpreters have to say about that verse?

Do you have the ability to read Matt Henry ? He says tons about every thing. What i got from a very quick scan  was the 70 ad destruction  Quick scan of Matt Henry does not do justice   to his works... 

Share this post


Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...
Articles - News